Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Should I stay or should I go … with Visual Studio 2005 or 2008 is the question in this particular case. One of my customers is still on Visual Studio 2003 and they are wondering whether to upgrade to VS 2005 or to VS 2008.

Are there reasons for moving to VS 2005 instead of 2008 even though 2008 is so close to release? Minimizing risk is probably the major driver for deciding on VS 2005. After all, it’s been out in the market for almost two years and it’s stable and mature. There’s also the common wisdom that you shouldn’t deploy a Microsoft product that doesn’t have at least one service pack. Mind you that SP1 for Visual Studio didn’t come out until 12 months after the release of the product. Microsoft is no longer in the mode where the Service Pack has to hit 6 months after release because there were quality issues that needed to be fixed.

When it comes to determining to move to the newer Visual Studio 2008 and the .NET Framework 3.5 there are more points to consider:

1) Stability and maturity of the underlying framework and consequently the applications you’re building on top of the framework.

2) Stability and maturity of new features added with VS 2008

3) Product Support differences.

4) Productivity benefits of VS 2008 compared to VS 2005.

Let’s dive a little deeper and examine each of these points:

1) Enhancements to the .NET Framework are built around the stable core of Version 2.0 that ship with Visual Studio 2005, when additions like generics and partial classes required modifying the CLR.

Version 3.0 added to the core set of .NET 2.0, but does not change the core CLR. New functionality is packed in new assemblies, e.g. System.ServiceModel. There were some minor changes to some of the library assemblies, e.g. System.Runtime.Serialization to accommodate new WCF functionality, but by all and large 3.0 is built around the solid core of the CLR and the BCL of 2.0.

Version 3.5 follows the same approach. The 2.0 CLR/BCL core remains largely untouched. New features are either implemented at the compiler level or in the System. Core assembly. Scott Hanselman (who’s finally joined Microsoft) confirmed this claim by doing some deeper research recently. He compared the core libraries that shipped with VS 2005 and the Beta 2 release of .NET 3.5 and found that the percentage of churn was in the single digits.

Since the .NET Runtime and the core libraries are pretty much the same between VS 2005 and VS 2008, there’s no increased risk for applications that leverage core .NET functionality only.

2) Now that we realized that .NET is very stable at its core, let’s look at the additional functionality that’s new with .NET 3.5. There are quite a number of new features (WCF, WPF, Visual Studio, Linq, too many others), but this particular customer is very interested in the new AJAX features. Again, the core framework code at the ASP.NET Ajax framework level has been in the public as a CTP since 2006 and has been RTM since early 2007. The Visual Studio 2008 release is adding more server side control features (for example control extenders), but the core has been publicly available as a preview release for more than 18 months. Another customer I work with is running one of the world’s largest eCommerce sites on top of AJAX some of these CTP bits without impact to their business.

Visual Studio 2008 adds design time tools and more server controls for richer UIs and better communication between the client-side code and the server. Those features are very helpful and the runtime features have been available in CTPs for a while.
Finally, one more risk mitigation factor to consider is recent announcement
that source code (with comments) and debugging symbols are going to be available with Visual Studio 2008 and .NET Framework 3.5. If you’re running into issues, you have the unprecedented ability to trouble shoot and diagnose problems.

With all that, my take would be (if I was an architect that didn’t work for Microsoft) that risk from new framework libraries around ASP.NET AJAX is manageable. In other areas, you get all the fixes for .NET 3.0 SP1, which means there’s actually a benefit of fewer pieces to install. The remaining risk is the new code in System.Core and in some other places. Still, I’d feel good about moving to 2008.

3) Now, you may argue that the tools are still new, and there’s some truth in that. Even though the quality of Visual Studio has been pretty good, much better than in the 90s when I first looked at Microsoft tools, but new code is always new risk. One could argue that VS 2005 + VS 2005 SP1 + .NET 3.0 + .NET 3.0 SP1 + ASP.NET AJAX RTM + AJAX Control Toolkit + ASP.NET AJAX Futures CTP gives me the same capabilities as VS 2008 with more stable, proven code. But consider this: The AJAX Control Toolkit is released under a community license, which means there’s not official product support through the Premier Support channels. The ASP.NET AJAX Futures CTP delivers some of the cool improvements over RTM, but the CTP is an unsupported product. The new controls that ship with VS 2008 are fully supported.

You’re actually increasing risk a little bit by staying with Visual Studio 2005 because of a few unsupported bits and you’re greatly increasing complexity of your install process. With VS 2008 you get the stable service pack code for Visual Studio and .NET 2.0 and 3.0 and you get all that in a single install and you get all that in a single install which reduces complexity and consequently risk and cost of deployment. I give that one to Visual Studio 2008.

4) Yes, there is new code in Visual Studio 2008 and there better be ;). VS 2005 has been lacking the tool support to take full advantage of the .NET 3.0 platform. VS 2005 shipped with .NET 2.0, remember? The .NET 3.0 release was only a framework release. The tool support for WPF, WCF and ASP.NET AJAX is finally shipping with VS 2008.

The
improved Javascript IntelliSense support alone is a great enhancement for somebody like me that delegates mundane tasks like remembering method overloads and signatures to IntelliSense. AJAX was painful because IntelliSense in the code editor was rather limited.

Then there’s the
client-side JavaScript debugging Scott Guthrie was talking about. You now can set breakpoints from the start, debug and inspect javascript variables with property grids, visualizers and an immediate window just like you can in with managed code on the server.


Then there are other very helpful new features, like the ability call WCF JSON services, the Web Designer with rich CSS Support or the built-in support to make the back button AJAX aware with the history control and, of course , Linq. There are many other exciting new features, too many others to list here, but the bottom line is, there are numerous reasons why VS 2008 is the better choice for developing AJAX enabled sites.

Finally, you could argue that VS 2008 actually gives you the best of both worlds because VS 2008 lets you target different versions of the .NET Runtime. If you’re feeling very strongly about shipping applications on the 2.0 bits or the 3.0 bits, you can still take advantage of the new productivity enhancements in the IDE but build against the framework version of your choice.That's a great combination or productivity and stable code to optimize for low risk.

Published Monday, October 08, 2007 9:01 AM by ChristophDotNet
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# web design » Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Monday, October 08, 2007 11:46 PM by Scott Hanselman

I'm not finding it risky at all and I'm doing all my dev, including DasBlog, on 2008 now.

As for the 2.0 Core changes, there's now an FxCop Rule to keep you from hurting yourself if you do end up using a new API: blogs.msdn.com/.../Multi_2D00_TargetingAndFxCop.aspx

# NBAVids - Basketball Rocks » Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Monday, October 22, 2007 8:48 AM by Mark Dykun

I have been using VS 2008 since Beta 2 almost exclusively. I have found it to be stable and at this point the most productive development environment. Some things are just incredibly easy and the inclusion of LINQ makes the creation of data centric applications all that more "Fun".

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Monday, October 22, 2007 8:57 AM by Andre

You must be kidding, VS2005 is "stable and mature"? Surely not for C++ development. The IDE and Intellisense is just a nightmare.

"Microsoft is no longer in the mode where the Service Pack has to hit 6 months after release because there were quality issues that needed to be fixed." - Yeah, right, the service pack for VS2005 should have been released within 1 month - or even better - VS2005 shouldn't have been released at all until it hit atleast the beta software quality bar.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Monday, October 22, 2007 9:00 AM by Johan Herscheid

Well.. The only problem i got with vs2008 is that Web Service Software Factory isn't supported jet. In VS2005 i can use this tool, but not the great features from VS2008 with LINQ, Javascript debugging and AJAX supported controls. So I am still thinking what the best way is to start from now.

# MSDN Blog Postings » Is is safer to stay with Visual Studio 2005 or go to VS 2008?

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# More reasons for Visual Studio 2008

Wednesday, October 24, 2007 10:13 AM by Community Blogs

Jon Box (Architect Evangelist extraordinaire) thought my post discussing risk differences between Visual

# Ghillie Suits » Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What’s more risk? - <ChristophDotNet

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Wednesday, October 24, 2007 3:06 PM by Joe Chung

Visual Studio 2008 Beta 2 is a mess just like Visual Studio 2005 Beta 2 was.  I hope 2008 RTM is better, but I expect it'll be just as bug-ridden as 2005 RTM was.  Microsoft developers love ZBB even if that means closing Connect issues without explanation rather than investigating and fixing them.

Re: 6 month SP mindset, it took Microsoft a year to release SP1 for VS 2005, and it actually broke things too.

Developers used to matter to Microsoft, but now that Microsoft is competing with the developers too, not so much.

# links for 2007-10-25 at DeStructUred Blog

Wednesday, October 24, 2007 10:22 PM by links for 2007-10-25 at DeStructUred Blog

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Friday, October 26, 2007 3:58 PM by Ian Suttle

I'm currently using both.  I use 2005 for development of my apps I'll release to a public production environment and 2008 for prototyping and .net 3.5 review.  I began using 2008 in Beta 1, currently use Beta 2, and have been extremely impressed with the stability of both.

# ThemePassion - Best stuff about design! » Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Saturday, October 27, 2007 6:05 PM by Don Smith

Johan, as far as the Web Service Software Factory goes, we are already planning the 2008 version. We haven't completely scoped it out all the way, but we do have a considerable amount of it ported from the 2005 version already. Also, we're already starting to feel the pressure from customers and upper Visual Studio management on getting it released. I'm trying to set an expection that it will be available before the end of February, but don't be surprised if it is available before then. Sorry for being vague, but that's all I have for now. Just keep a look out here for updates: www.codeplex.com/.../View.aspx

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Monday, October 29, 2007 2:25 AM by Steve Teixeira

>>You must be kidding, VS2005 is "stable and mature"? Surely not for C++ development. The IDE and Intellisense is just a nightmare.<<

Hi Andre, Of course you're correct that VS2005 Intellisense has some serious issues, particularly with very large projects.  We're in the process of releasing a patch for VS2005 that addresses some of these issues, which we hope to announce on http://blogs.msdn.com/vcblog this week.

All the best,

Steve Teixeira

Group Program Manager, VC++

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Thursday, November 01, 2007 9:39 PM by RW

All I want and need is the ADO Entity Framework to be completed and included.

.NET has suffered long enough from not have good database support within the language or the IDE.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, November 20, 2007 10:36 PM by Randy Worrell

I have 2008 Beta 2, and am working in it trying to decide whether or not to move from 2005.  Without spending the bucks to get 2008 RTM, is Beta 2 close enough to where I can continue objective evaluation?

# Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, November 27, 2007 9:04 AM by Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Thursday, December 13, 2007 6:02 PM by Mike

Would it be possible to continue using .net framework (Only the redistributable .net framework 3.0) with VS 2005 without buying VS 2008?

I think so but I may get accurate answer

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Thursday, February 14, 2008 6:21 AM by Arti

As per my experience Visual studio 2005 is better to work .

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Thursday, February 14, 2008 6:18 PM by Quinn McGuire

Does VS 2008 work with XP and Vista?  I was told it was for Vista only and have been trying to research this.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Friday, February 22, 2008 8:29 PM by Joe

I read about that too. Someone or something have clarify that because Vista is a failure.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, April 08, 2008 1:38 AM by NiTiN

Visual Studio 2005 is buggy when it comes to ASP.NET development. The designer often displays the properties for the wrong control, it reports errors and requires a re-build to correct itself when writing custom code, and more.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Thursday, April 10, 2008 5:15 AM by vsuser

Hi i am using vs 2005 to develop C++ app., and contineously facing the problem in porting exe. it requires vc runtime on client pc. is this same in vs 2008.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Wednesday, April 23, 2008 12:44 PM by Crash

VS 2008 works on XP.  I am running it fine, and I am running the WSSF:Modeling Edition (great) and have tweaked the Repository Factory code to run in VS2008.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Wednesday, May 28, 2008 7:11 AM by BOze

Hi Crash,

Is the tweaked Repository Factory code for VS2008 published somewhere? Or is it public?

I currently trying to use Repository Factory with VS2008, but unfortunately I don't have much time available to try to tweak it myself. I am using Web Client Software Factory Feb 2008, and I would really like to use a Microsoft based architecture and data access generation tool.

Could you help me out on this?

Thanks in advance!

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Friday, June 06, 2008 10:16 AM by KavithaB

I am currently using 2005 and 2008. Both of them have been similar so far. I think they both are fine. If I find either of them buggy, I shall surely get back here and let you folks know.!

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, June 17, 2008 1:26 AM by Parshant

I think both are same. VS 2008 having little changes.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Saturday, July 05, 2008 5:58 AM by matt

I use 2005 but i am thinking the same question

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Wednesday, July 09, 2008 6:20 AM by Suresh from U S A

hi Every one

      Give me full detail about Microsoft visual studio 2205 and 2008

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Friday, July 11, 2008 5:25 AM by Emilio

Nice article but not suitable for printing :(

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Monday, July 28, 2008 5:33 PM by Daniel

I got the repository factory for VS 2008 installer from here - http://ratnakarg.wordpress.com

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:59 AM by Aneesh

What is the different between Visual studio 2005 and Visual Studio 2008?

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, October 14, 2008 11:14 PM by CHN

I hope AJAX functionality is improved in VS 2008.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Friday, December 12, 2008 1:44 AM by Joy

What is the major difference between VS 2005 or VS 2008?

# Website Directory - Risk

Thursday, January 01, 2009 9:37 PM by Website Directory - Risk

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Wednesday, February 04, 2009 6:44 AM by dropings

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Sunday, February 08, 2009 8:15 AM by jamm

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Sunday, February 08, 2009 8:21 AM by henni

If you are looking for new music, soft or games, you can find it on http://newfileengine.com/

It is the best search engine in the internet.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Wednesday, April 01, 2009 11:36 AM by Zoon

Hello,

   I have a question for the community.  I received a Visual C++ project built in Visual Studio 2008;  I tried to load this project into Visual Studio 2005, and it failed.  The error is

"....Error Message:'9.00' violates enumeration constraint of '7.00 7,00 7.10 7,10 8.00 8,00'. The attribute 'Version' with value '9.00' failed to parse..."

  Can someone help me with this?  Many many thanks

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Sunday, May 03, 2009 11:26 AM by Music Guy

Hi,

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, August 18, 2009 2:47 PM by Vijay

From a migration project prespective, which one would offer the best environment. Lets say I am migrating an existing VB 6.0 to .NET 3.5 C# .

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Thursday, February 04, 2010 8:39 PM by Ron Chong

I Agree with this totally.

Tuesday, April 08, 2008 1:38 AM by NiTiN

Visual Studio 2005 is buggy when it comes to ASP.NET development. The designer often displays the properties for the wrong control, it reports errors and requires a re-build to correct itself when writing custom code, and more.

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 8:05 AM by Harikumar

In my point of view , visual studio 2008 will be better than 2005

# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

Sunday, December 12, 2010 5:26 PM by Shashank Swasthi(SOFTWARE DEVELOPER)

both are the different version........

# Advantages of VS 2008 over VS 2005 - Programmers Goodies

Wednesday, July 06, 2011 5:31 AM by Advantages of VS 2008 over VS 2005 - Programmers Goodies

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

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# re: Visual Studio 2005 or 2008? What's more risk?

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