Philip Rieck

Phil in .net

To beta or not to beta-- The previewer's dilemma

I went to the PDC.  I got the bits.  I played with Whidbey and ASP.NET 2.0.  I fell in love.

Back in the real world of work, I'm about to start a 4-6 month project.  During this project we'll have to:

  1. Use (or write our own) a page templating solution that will allow a consistent look and feel across the site with minimal effort per-page.  Hmm, master pages would be perfect
  2. Allow personalization.  Hmm, doesn't asp.net 2 have a personalization engine?
  3. We'll use objects as data sources. Unfortunately our interns will have to forgo the use of the designers because they don't support this at design time.  Hey, doesn't whidbey have an object datasource?

We'd like to:

  1. validate against XHTML. Not going to happen with VS2003.
  2. pre-compile the huge number of pages / ascx's this project may have to catch compilation errors before the page or code-path is hit.  Wish I could do this

Yikes- I want Whidbey! Now!.  I can get lots of this now from different or home-grown solutions, but in 9 months or a year when this application is re-visited, I'll be using Whidbey.  Wouldn't it be great if I didn't have to

  1. Spend time now hacking together what whidbey already has in the alpha?
  2. Not have to rewrite the code later to use whidbey features? (or support both?)

So here I am, reimplementing things that Microsoft has already built, grumbling because I can't use it.  This doesn't even touch the other things I want (generics, refactoring, stencils, other “neat“ features)

I don't understand why people would want to consult a psychic - It sucks to know the future when you're stuck in the present.

Posted: Nov 20 2003, 08:28 AM by philipr | with 5 comment(s)
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Comments

Thomas Tomiczek said:

Forget Whidbey.

I am in a similar sitation with a project or ours, and basically - Whidbey is not ready yet for anything larger. Once an updated prebeta is out, yes.

But you run RISKS now. Not having the new stuff working is not one - I dont need ObjectSpaces, I have our own O/R mapper which is classes better. I dont need most of their controls either.

But I would love master pages, I would love generics.

Still, the price paid is way too high, imho. No, not yet.
# November 20, 2003 9:37 AM

Scott Galloway said:

Most of these things are possible, MasterPages (e.g., Paul Wilson's version) can be done quite simply in Asp.NET 1.1 (not AS easily as Whidbey, but still pretty effective). XHTML output is possible too (see http://www.liquid-internet.co.uk/content/dynamic/pages/series1article1.aspx). I believe Paul Wilson also has a class to allow limited precompilation, I also recall a tool to convert User Controls to server controls (can't find it right now).
The next big thing is always appealing unfortunately, but I wouldn't not do anything just because in a years time there's an easier way to do it (when Whidbey is finally realeased, Orcas will be the next big thing...). I believe that the Aplha does not have a 'Go Live' license wither (not idea if the beta will) - so you can't legally use it in live sites anyay...
# November 20, 2003 9:55 AM

Matthias Cavigelli said:

I think the task of validating against xhtml can be achieved by following the instructions at
http://www.liquid-internet.co.uk/content/dynamic/pages/opensourcearticles.aspx

Congratulations to your decision to follow the xhtml standard!
# November 20, 2003 9:57 AM

Andrew said:

I have a templating system.
It does show not the graphics of the template in your page while designing, but it allows multiple content section in the template that are panel-like controls on your page at design time.

I built it to work with VS.Net design mode, but the core functionality is independant of VS.
I haven't been able to try the Whidbey MasterPages , but from what I've read, moving from mine to that would not be unfeasable.

There is a very vanilla site at UITemplates.Net ( I'm no designer)

It is worth looking at.

You can drop me a mail : andrewseven [at] hotmail dot com
# November 20, 2003 10:11 AM

Andrew said:

It is always like that send the link and it dies...

The .net domain name is timing out... have to check that after work.

http://uitemplates.europe.webmatrixhosting.net/
# November 20, 2003 12:23 PM
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