Infacta & GroupMail: They Suck Big Time

13 Comments

• Tom,
  
  I don't ordered a CD because: 1) i don' need it and 2) I stopped used them looooong way ago.
  
  The point you're missing is I don't want and never wanted an "upgrade protection" or whatever other name you use to really say "subscription".
  
  I was always able to download the software I paid for from any other vendor I used in the past. This is the very first time that access to my original purchase is banned and I'm asked for $85 to get it reenabled.
  
  You can call this "upgrade protection" (not sure why, because I'm not looking for any upgrades here) but I call this ripping off a customer (ex-customer, that is).
  
  thanks,
  -Victor.
  

• Seems like its been a long time since I read something on your blog... too long ;) :D
  
  Thanks for the heads up, it doesn't sound like they actually sell the software, they are just renting out access to a version of the software.
  
  I have no issues with charging for new versions but I do find it odd to charge for minor revisions.
  
  -A
  
  Tom: While I can understand that you need to get paid for new/continuing development, I find it quite questionable to cut off access to what was purchased. Do your CDs auto-destruct after a year?
  
  
  
  
  

• Hi A-
  
  GroupMail will continue to work whether Upgrade Protection is renewed or not.
  
  The issue that this brings up, I suppose, is whether we could develop a system where we can easily manage one-time retroactive downloads for older versions to thousands of customers who don't want upgrades but access to an archived version because of a computer crash - and how to automate that process without it costing a fortune.
  
  And, no the CD doesn't auto-destruct after a year ; )
  

• Tom: you're mixing up "Upgrade protection" with "access to a download section".
  
  The first is about keeping the software updated and asking people to pay for that, which is perfectly fine, but not the topic of discussion here.
  
  The second is about suspending the access to the download location of the purchased software until you collect an extra $85.
  
  They look very-very different to me.
  
  And I don't see how this could cost a fortune... really... take a look at services like Amazon S3, they charge $0.18 for a 1GB transfer, that is $0.00017 for 1MB, so the $85 you're asking me for would buy 472.22GB worth of downloads.
  
  If you want to charge people to download the already purchased software, go ahead, just make it something reasonable and don't mix this with "upgrade protection" which isn't at play here.
  

• @ Tom: if you're really charging $85 for access to purchased bits I would say this is a very questionable practice indeed...
  

• Tom: If this is something that doesn't come up a lot, then the cost of keeping previous versions available with an automatic system isn't justified.
  
  When it does comes up, you have customer service look in the big folder of previous versions and email the customer a copy of what they had purchased.
  
  What you are doing at the moment sounds to me like a protection racket.
  
  
  

• Victor: reading about your experience dealing with us and looking up the recent history of email correspondence with you, I would tend to agree with your conclusion (the they suck bit).
  
  1. From the initial phone call you should have been asked for a number/email address so that we could call/email you back
  
  2. Tom mans the office in the US on his own, so if he is not available, we need to make it so caller details are passed back so that someone from our main office responds in a timely fashion
  
  I think its obvious that we failed to provide adequate help to you in this situation, it was totally unnecessary for you to have to phone/email numerous times, I accept that for the above points we were fully at fault and we will work on fixing them.
  
  Regarding the upgrade protection, its more than just providing access to bits, its about access to the most up to date version, regardless of whether its a major/minor release. We have lots of people happily using older versions of GroupMail without having ever paid upgrade protection and it is optional.
  
  Currently we do not provide an archive to the last version each person downloaded/installed, sure the cost of doing this is not an issue. It can however cause its own problems for example if it was pre Vista/XP etc the older version may not work with the current operating systems.
  
  Saying that our main focus is regardless of when you downloaded the software in the last 12 years, whether or not you bought it and whether or not you purchased upgrade protection, when you phone or email for assistance we are here to help. On rare occasions that "help" ends in an experience that sucks, I accept that in this case, we're an ongoing work in progress ;-) but I don't believe its the norm
  
  I agree with the points that we should distinguish between requiring access to the latest versions and just wanting to download the installation again, from now I think we should provide the download links on request, if it comes up regularly enough we'll look into automating the process.
  
  Here's to sucking less in the future ;-)
  

• Seems you got a quicker response posting to your own blog... ;-)
  

• In fairness, and I think Victor will be able to confirm this, after the initial missed calls debacle there was a conversation going on via email.
  

• Thanks Dave for responding. It's good to hear you are considering in the future offering the download installation separately from your 'upgrade protecion' based on my feedback. These two are really different things.
  
  And yes, after the missed calls I did have a fluent conversation with Tom via email, unfortunately we didn't agree much, but having the discussion at all is always a good thing.
  
  Just for the records: I haven't found the original purchased MSI and you already know paying $85/year for it didn't sound reasonable to me, so I have moved on to use another product now.
  

• Victor - what are you currently using if you don't mind my asking?
  
  I am using an older version of GroupMail and I have now left two messages for Tom about upgrading in the last week and have had no response.
  
  What are are using? How does it compare (feature wise, price)?
  
  It may be worth a switch.
  
  Don
  

• Hi Don. I replied to an email from you on October 24th. I haven't heard back from you - actually 6 minutes after your message was sent. I apologized for not being available when you called, but responded immediately when I saw your message.
  
  I've forwarded that message to you in the event that you didn't receive it.
  
  Best regards
  
  Tom
  

• Hey Victor. Just wanted to add here that we have discussed this issue as Dave mentioned earlier and have all agreed that the line had become blurred with our Upgrade Protection process and download access for existing customers who require a new install due to issues such as yours.
  
  Thanks for helping us to see the light with this issue.
  
  If you haven't been sorted out yet, let me know and I'll sort things out on our end.
  
  Tom
  
  oleary (at) infacta (dot) com